HASZARD’S

GAZETTE, MAY 21.

WIDIIAI. LMIILATUBB. Hons: on Assnsnar, April 4, I858. ALABIBS B

DIBATIOITIIS

'I‘haDebstaacnthinB' w

l—vthn several questions as ' ti

, lievcnflliargc tluwlitggf bk

(3 early ' duties ' hie montfli He, rifle

. 0“. h‘ F olds ‘ct ‘ oflcos o lomolumeiit, and has nit

~--.-M 2:‘! ‘''':i:..‘‘'‘° .: ...."f*..:..'...‘.‘.':".*.;

, banhhr. £30 a car is, tho.-vflor/2, a

' ' ertlf tIO"‘7or£QQpl¢ reaiuustitlcn his public services t whole House. in is capacit of Attornc General. With Mr. Faasss. He was not in favor til the Bill. respect to the tbouohiry, thinkit woulillie

Should it i t l w, the provini of it so is as agrPn.n:td|,owo'uld, instead of”. . a v Qviag ' blie, entail an additional annual

I the t ' ' 1' f i." ll ll .t.’a'-‘.7Mls.i.’.2.’si'lo°2°i:il'lti?!a7’ 1'ie'-Mei sdtethe ‘ cftlie Salaries db s rura- “5fiT cti\iltI"ba‘slT Eiiihodiaiily "pro- '- vednhattheywateabcvealli

ravsrsge of the fees of which they were-to be'a commutation." tvenldmavethelrecesiuiittal of the B’ ‘;th'.at day

The united Salaries of‘ the two £ " for the ’ Attorney

IN (or the Solicitor‘ General-— wosld amount to

a commutation, alone altinntedl

‘ -ieai. by iami Salaries, _ er ‘ 1 less dIth'|IIli’hIdb00n‘paId, in the as one of them onl , last ear, there would evident-

ly bnasaviag to the ublic, from the commutation.

, , lion. Mr. Porn. he hon. member for Prince

‘ County‘ Mr. lllrasar) wan uiintalen ifhe thought “ " gain eredit front the country for his mo- ‘ If he thought‘£400 a year too much to pay

nting

3 .

‘the Crown Law-Ofiai-s for their public tervloehsf O hlad -" hie (Mr. l-‘nae a)’ motion been made to get rid of-the Bill because the Balarine were too small‘, he " (Bob. Mr‘. reps) might,‘ perhaps, have felt die- to

what he could think they ought to be allowed '(lIon. Mr. Pope was,et a loss to imagihe. ‘

' bliahing'ofa fair scale or 'otlet‘a and oilcers of the Supreme Conn. awyera‘ fees were enormously extravagant ;-and ‘ theywere loudly complained of by the country. ' If, for instance, a man had to sue for £10, the e of the suit would cost him almost, if not {til y, as much as the debt. The question was then put on Mr. Fraser's mo- tion; and the House divided thereon : - . Yeu.s—h!r. Fraser, Mr. Mr. Macneil, Hon. ‘ Hr. Whelan.

’ Ccles, Hon. Mr. Warbtirton, Mr. Csmpicn, Mr. Macaulay, Hon. Mr. Palmer,

Mr. Havilnnd, Mr. Wightman. Mr. Moonev. '

‘ the ‘S't|ilicitor Gsnral should be it

nal

“Pl”:

‘. ‘in the Government. ' mined 'tbat‘tlie Bill shall pass,

salaries to he established y-it of one and increasing those of another. The ave- rage of the ProIhouctary'n fees is £150, and yet it is pro £170.

aetlug

‘I or our guide is ‘es

Mr. Mosrooiisar. , any General with a salary of £M0 a year. at- taehed to it, ‘as _ _ a much better one‘ than either that of the Colonial Secretary or that of the Treasurer. It will even

1,... represent inc mbentitlhas been, the wt cm'c:'ili°tlie Colony, nllltough there may be 6 cutting down of etuolumnnts to the amount of

£187 a year. £300.a year to the Attorae Geno gal, and £100 a car to the Solicitor ' would be soon h under anysiruumetaoces. Hon. Mr.' _ as. be‘ alterations which ' have been made in the Land-Asneasnietit ‘A'¢t win materially reduce the fees ofthe Attorney Geno ‘gal; and that consideration, lthinli, ought to have operated in the minds of hon. members etiainnt the reducing of his salary from £400, at which it‘ was man aged,’ ‘to hes the present ‘justice was Attorney General, the annual ave- ’ pagacriiie fees of the once was, I believe, much greater than it is nowrlrtlt. "ill II It III!» I ehauot think it an gn' prlneip in the ‘Bill, that it eateries for the Piothcnotsry and the‘ 'oa,.ei'ar,' exrfnnlitig the averagb of their fee whilst es liahing one for the Attorney Genera ' eonaiderab y the avenge cfhis. providers salary of £170 for ‘the Prothonotary, "' whlisthn will be entitled to receive fees of onion hpzount of £200 a year besides‘ thus

ruvidee

£70n year more than it given to the

tile General. '

1 A N.’ The public dntien which the A00!!!’ General would have to perform, for his ‘ “[3,, - not on e‘ him, altogether, for more than one month out of the twelve; but the

-I "was nllt year round. ‘ rant. ' approve of the arrange- ’ on ofdntitn, tirade by the Bill, with the Attorney General a he Solicitor. lowing a fair salary to the Iolisitor,

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provides. II‘ the discharge of a_fair share of _oIcIal duties, ,'attlin-bfiatime in providing an equally llrhbffihdmm. l l . ' n,..of'cIeial.‘lutlss, satlnol ger st-‘ta reserve IO’ what

soqtiithi I‘ _l"an

‘have It in his ptri will in! M-M W.‘ 5''"! tern upon ll|Ocs.0Il¢ll0l.

ndtheltelicito

thirty): 3 i‘; i 5: E

:39.‘ §" ‘a... C‘

H to th tof duties to be discbar b it ° °*"::::.... ......., .... 8°" " Y

£400 a year; and thejhes of the Attorney Genral. for which hie S la_ry was to be ‘ ' gsrto £400. “ Surely thea,'U the two Crown Law Ilcoriwnre,

' is future, to he remunerated: tbr their public‘ ser-

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amino shape of fees.

" not favourable to permanent would much prefer the cata- nble of Fees, for all law~

Hon. Mr. Pope, Mr. Davies. Hon. Mr.‘

r. Ltvngworih, ‘ Mr. Montgomery, Mr. Clark. Hon. Mr. Jarditie, Mr. Cour. I think it quite right that ‘ iaed _ as a

public ofioer, by the Ian 'elatcro’s establishing a for ‘him, and that a should, consequently, oflcial capacity, to take part

If, however, we are deter- let us fix all the on equally fair ‘ everagen; not by cutting down the emoluments

to commute them for a salary of

fire average of the Attorney Genenl'a - tennis £437, and it is propped to commute I‘. them for £300; This cannot right.’ Iris‘ not ‘ ‘ fairly br impartially to add £00 a car to the niaoluiiierita of one, while cutting oil‘ I'll a

' year fltom those of the other. If the Bill is to be ‘ fudgiflod with let us take the average of the nice I think the ethos of Attor-

idce other niece and fees, will be

encrsl,

Chief

evidence ofthe recognition of

liciicr

The Bill

',th|t he shall take upon himself

inoy General, it; rcvides

vs advantagesi Itt-_ ‘flu in to the interns of I’

priuci lc of the Bill is to be adhered to, there must a cuttin down of the tllllullllilflllls ilr ofice. The cflcia duties of the Attoriit-_v IS»- ueral are not at all comparable to those oi’ the

easurer or of the Colonial Sccrctar ; they ab; UI9':llQl§1lpIl'thpll"0l'either. on contra-

I

beat to establish his salary cm as avers and hi loan the £«i0.io bsuoutingenacn the ant of duties he ma have to perform ' to be either

ysar'wImr ;‘1!rIot: lfalfdwbdflil‘ be as a remuneration for the, performanotvof extra duties. And I world robomaaoad that the Bill be passed for a limited period, and then im thee ticirufthat period,’ it be found that any in he Ind been made, with respect - one of the amount of salary, it will be easy to rectify it.

Hon. Mr. sun. I iaust say I have been much amused by the uianteuvrin of sciue huh. members with respect to the di rent proposi- tions which have been submitted since the con- sideration of this Bill was first entered upon in Committee oftbe whole House. The hon. mbm- ber for the First District of Queen's County

..Mr. Coles) had firsl: proposed that the Sn- lary of the Attorii General should be £400 a year, but the cry 0 economy raised by some of the hon. members around him, bavin , it woul seem, occasio in him some fear t at others would outbid him for ‘gipularity, he had sud- denly come down to £3 , a lower sum than had been roposcd b any other hou.mcmbcr.llIon. Mr. &)LB denied that he had proposed 400; and explained that who ' posed to bein lieu of all- fees, and on account of some to be paid into the Treasury, he said, ‘ The adoption of that mode would occasion much uncertainty concerning what ought to be paid into the Treanuy, and could not be depended u u for the e acting of any public saving.’] e had certainly said £400 would be little enough. Formerly when the amount of Salaries was made a question in the As- sembly, it was not sought,‘ by some hon. members, to determine their amount by a fiiir reference to the amount of duties to be per- fiirmuzlycn accounuihcf them ; but, on the contra- ry, ar ed t the on consideration b which the glarlea of Publiicy Oflicers ought tab

ated, was what the country could afford. ith t to ofloe, the position of those who formerly argued in that way, in the Assembly, is now changed; and their mode of reasoning on that question is also changed, in accordance with their own change of position. They now my, “ We must keep up the salaries as long as we can ; for it is for our own immediate inter- est to do so ;” and, on this principle the evinced a determination to not, until a propcs was made for commuting the fees of the Prctho- nohr for a fixed sa the agiplicabili bong“ t or the

r pa, not quite so appai-ant ; and until some Jl:iIousy of one another arose smongt them-, selves in bidding for popularity on the score of

$8‘

, with respect to which ? of the principle, for their own urtlie

ccouom . Then came (proposal for the re- duction of the Attorney eneral's Salary to £300, after itlhad been at £400; and,

hence. the determination to reduce, if possible, the salary of the Prothcnota , below the fair average of his olioial fees. ow ting that we have fairly determined the amount of salary to be given to tho Attorno General, bow, in the naiuc of common sense shou like to know can the Attorney General be alectod by what we give to to the Pro uomi-y. V We have done with the Attorney General ; let the Salary to be allowed to the Prothonotary be argued and de- termined on its own merits. The avora which it was, at lint, determined to esta lish the Pi-othonotary’s Sela is a little below the true one; and, if we ad are to it, that ofice will be as badl paid as any public servant in the Colony.

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I: must be remembered that we took away from him a Salary of £90 stcrliii , and, until last year, when he was allowed £ , give him nothing in the way of compensation. ow, let a fair comparison be made between the public services of the may General and those of the Prothonotary ; and then m which of these two oficars is justly cntitl e higher salary. I may, I think, be allowed to‘ say that I am ca bls of deciding, as ajudge,in the case; and I lnre that I would sooner ie- ohargo the duties of the Attorney General twice

over for his pro as u I would acquit myself of of the thonohry once, or the which it is

pplacd to allow him , andall his fans in additiolfl. e Attorney Geno- ral’s duties were never very onerous ; but,if this Bill became law, the will be less than ever. The Solicitor Gene , hitherto, has been merely the Counsel of the Attorney General, who, how- ever, was not bound to employ him as such, but now, as this Bill rovides a suitable salary for him, he will be d y recognised as a Imw-ofiicer of the Crown. and will lave to take a fair share of the olllcial duties of the Crown Law-Oficers ; and the Attorney General may fairly divide the business with him-—one only going the circuit —each in his turn, as in the other Colonies, where they seldom both But altlicu h we have provided for the li toning of the ties of the Attorney Genera . it cannot fairly be said that we have materially diminished the emoluments, a ’ ' to him In virtue of his of- ficc; for we leave untouched all that he is enti- te, as Advocate Gene. iralty Court, and, as Attorney General, under the land Assessment Act. If we vided for the Colonial Secre-

determiniu what onghalzo ' t

ratios of their ‘views, was, eight;

iieral had behfl to his (Hon. Mr. I’itliucr‘s) pttrtyl Ii! Kink not. And imiy not Illt‘, Iflflll why he Gibbs £1” too small ll Stiliiry Iir the Profliouotary be found in the fut-t tlitit Int utluuau belong to the lion. and learned mom ‘s on school of politics. I rather think so. Such considerations, however, ought not ' once us in such questions. All that we have to determine is how we can best promote the psflie Interests, indtpcpdently of all pert-. arty or personal considerations. Let the Bill based upon principles of justice, and let us adhere to t. we principles in all its provisions. There has, indeed, been ii. (I deal of slitifilin v and fltictnating on but ' es of the lloune ; an the views cfueithcr rty, with me icct to the Bill, have bscuequi bly sustained t rougltout: several of the minority, and ii few of the majo- ijdillc astra The he and icertifi iucinber ii. Mr. inter)‘ has not, there rbuimiaiea upon theshullingof some hon. members without suficieut cause ; ‘but he seems not to be aware that he himself is among the shtillers. He spoke in ihvcr of £400 wh the Attorney General‘s Salary was fixed at that sum,and now he says a Salary of £300 will ban vsgy cm lo one for that ollicer. on. r. Pauisa. The sum of£400 was not rcgpleed by me. The proposal for establishing he lary at that amount proceeded llrom the hon. member’s own side of the House.

The motion of the lion. Mr. Worms for u. re- oonsideration of the question of the Attorney General’s Salary, not having been eecondcd,was withdrawn.

CLERK OF THE CROWN AND PB0l'HON0- r.tnv's saunv.

Hon. Mr. Cons. The hon. and learned mem- ber for Charlottetown (Hon. Mr Palmer) has mistaken what I said about the Salary of the Attorney General. I d' not ro- pose £400, but I said I would prefer till his ces

eing commuted that there might be no cavilling or bickering about what fees should be retained by the At- torue General and what should paid into the 'I¥i-easury by him. The only reason, how- ever, I am strongly inclined to believe, why that lion. and learned gentleman and his friends near him have now voted for £300 ’ the present Attorne general is not one of their party or in favor with them. With respect to the Salary of the Prothcnotary, £170 is above the average of his own returns. (No! No! from several hon. members. Yes, it is : and I contend that if we fix h at £150, in- stead of £170, we shall still be dealing more li- berally by liim than by the Attorney General. His Deputies will be well satisfied with £25 each; and, after payin them, his emoluments of cfice—his salary an private foes together- will amount to at least £250, if not £300, it

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O F

‘<

ear. Mr. Mowcoirssv. In in consideration of the question of the Salaries to allowed to the At- torney General and the Prothonctary, I am not influenced by my private feelings with rcs t to the gentlemen who now hold those appoint- ments, These gentlemen, Mr. Ilodgsou and Young, are not to be in ofice for ever. I wish, in voting upon the question of the Solar of ' r, to guided solely by a fair cousi ont- tion of what will be a just: remuneration for the services to be performed in consideration of the Solar . I am in favor of the lowest sum pro- sedy for the Salary of the Attorney General, gzcausel think a fair average of 's fees does not show him to be entitled to any more; if, in- deed, it entitles him to so much. The extrava- gance of several of the items by which the At- torney era llsof Costs against the Go- vei-umeut were swdled out in their smotmm, was very happily exposed, the other evenin , by the hon. mem r m Murray arbour ( on. Mr. Thornton), when he showed that his Bills of Costs, in cases of criminal roscciition, were made u of such charges as 2 s. for instructing the Cler of the wn to draw an indictment, 10s. (id., for fusing and signing the same, 13s. ., drawings brief, 10s., and for “ a mo- tion,” such as " , I move that the pri- soner be now turn good,” five of which, as the hon. membcr had said, might be made in five minutes. On such charges as these, particular- ly that of the famous motion, I cannot think it right that the avenge of the fees of the Attor- ney General, on which his salary is to be osm- blished, should be taken. It is not so, however, with respect to the fees of the Prothonotar ; and I do not think that, ifs Fee Act were to passed, an of his charges would be reduced by it. I think that by tttltin the average of the Pi-othonotary‘s fees, for t roe years, we may arrive at a ir conclusion respecting the amount of Salary for which they ought to be commuted.

Mr. WIOBTIAN. ‘The charges made b the Prothonctary have been neither exor itaiit nor exti-ava nt. The average on his own own statement for ll years, was .€l33; on a shorter perictl, it may be more. He is certainly a very etiicieiit oficcr; and I should not like to see his emoluments of case too much out down. .€l70 may be perhaps too much, whilst £l50 may be too little. I think we had better determine the amount cfaalary at something between these two name.

Mr. Loitowoirrit. The Attcmey General brought over a lawyer froiu Nova Scctis to assist him in the discharge of his clficial duties. I should like to ltnow whether that lawyer was paid, for his services, by the Government. If he was, the sum paid to him ought not to be taken into account, in entimatin the average of the Attorney General's face. a ad.ii waatobs remembered, assistance provided for him in another way, at the expense oi the people: the £40 allowed to the Prothoiictary, was paid to that olllcer for drawing indictments for the Attorney General.

on. Mr. Cons. The Prothonotary does no more for the present Attorney General, than he did for his predecessor: and unto his having brought over a lawyer from Nova Scull, to assist him, in the discharge of his duties some time ago, he had been obliged to d so. because he could not find one at our own ‘r on whom he could depend. With respect to the avers e of the Prothonotary‘s fees. as made out from t at o r’s own state- meraltar from Damley (Mr. Clark) aayn those statements are not correct. I however, believe they are uite correct; and that we shall be doing that r perfect justice in pladlngiinplicit reliance thereon, and striking an average, upon them, by which to detertnioe the amount of the salary to be allowed him. The amount of his less appsersto have nuottiatnd very much; being, in one ytlar, for Queen's County, £46‘; in another, £00: in a third, £46; in a fourth, £46; in a Bill, £70; in aaixtll, £00; and, in one, as low as £31. I am, however, fair- ztlred eat with the (“Ionian ; and, to and all caril-

g about it, lam wi ‘rig to allow H50, although the fair average is e'n'ly l .

Mr. Curr. ‘ l ‘ lagies to that amount; but only because I lhinh’ no stars can be got; and from I ‘re to have done with the question.

- In liswswon-rs. The true average it the Prothcnotary’a returns is £170: and yet. a hough the has ark) seen

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estate: neat Dunioyuptt-. ci thae,haconeentateaeeeptoi‘.€l ,taer:ly because

uahah p.ma-4.1

7. ‘l: . J

for ti sullicient fixed Salary, til W

, is because I

M,._ clause for commuting the charges of the Queen's

Mr. l‘i.anx. l coiist-iit lo tttlte £l50, because, ll l Ill) not. the Im1illIlllllii_\' be still further reduced; for It has been s:titl by some lion meiiipers that it ought not In lt8 more than U00. I would not consent to cut ilown llie enitiltiiiieiils of so good and efficient an oliicer as Mr. Hoduscn. If I could- IVII ll. "_

lion. Mr. Poi-I. I tsinnot see that circum- stances lay the hon. member (Mr. (fbrk) under any necessity to subiiiit. If he yielda,be nan- dotis victory of his own free will. and surrenders at discretion. The true average of the Pr0tlion- ctar_v‘s fees is £173, and to commute‘ them for tt Salary of £150 will be tin not of positive in'ustice to a most deserving cflcer. If his sa ary be fixed at that amount, alter peyin his Deputies, he will have only £100 a-year lc for himself

Hon. Mr. Coles. There is no wish to dis-

ra the olicial merits of Mr. llodgaon. We all a mit his abilities and cfiicienc ; and, in iixiu his salary at £150, in lieu o the f _ to whic he would, otherwise, be entitled, as C erk of the Crown, whilst he will continue to be entitled to all fees heretofore received by him, as Pi-cthonotai-y,—thercb securing to him, on the whole an income 0 a-year-,—-we sha deal much more liberally with him than we have done with the Attorney General.