; 1. i f t . ;‘, t

‘

PRINCE

voi.'iii.]

COLONIAL LnGisLATuRE. (Debate on the Delegate question continued from our last.)

The delegate, then, had not so much to complain Ofthe disadvantage produced to himself in not being able to communicate personally with Lord John Russell; nor should he complain oftlre effect of His Excellency the Lieutenant Governor‘s private Despatcli on the subject, which had been ouce’ortwice alluded to by honourable mem- bers, with much meaning. Contain what it might, and what, be (M r. Palmer) knew not, (never having heard of it until the answer to it was published in this Island,) it could not be more, ifas much, than the other side ofthe question, so as to prevent a total as: parts statement. In Nova Scotia, the Lieutenant Governor had sent home counter Delegates. Confidential as the Despatch was, how- ever, if the delegate considered it an obstruction, such is the perfection of our constitution, that it was, and is still liable to be examined into, and, on a proper application, might be delivered up, ifsupposed to contain any thing unconstitutional; but this he had no reason to suspect. He (Mr. Palmer) thought the delegate lost a great deal of time, last spring, before setting. out on his mission ; be, however, arrived in London early in July, and the Parliament sat until the 27th August; and yet he took no step towards applying to Parliament. Why did he not remain in England till the Cor- responding Committee informed him of the answer sent to his Excellency here. Nay, what was to have prevented his remaining there all winter, and, if prosecuting his duties with any success, trusting to the Legislature here to supply him with additional means, should those which he had run short? What was his hurry, then, to get back to the Island last autumn? Was there any magical or other particular attraction in that cushioned chair which he saw before him? (Hear, hear!) Was his patriotism for his country, his zeal in its cause, so over oivering, that be was afraid to trust that chair to an other indivi ual member Of this House than himself? He (Mr. almer) thought such an apprehension need not to have hurried him back: lie, for his part, considered that there were others in the house who were far more competent to fill it than the delegate; and those too of his own party. With respect to the Law opinion, his excuse for not having obtained it was by no means satisfactory. He (Mr. Palmer) knew well that had such an opinion been pub- lished in this Island, it would have had a powerful influence on the minds ofthe tenantry; it would have been “ a light to their path.” The delegate himself, in private consultations With the (country, at public meetings,aiid through the publichapers, was constant y representing the disadvantages they experienced for want oftlio advice ofable and impartial Counsel. Look, Mr. Chairman, at his opinion of the Bar and Bench of this Island, as expressed in the Colonial'Herald of the 22:! December, 1838, It was not, he! says, any part 'of his instructions; but will this miserable excuse be re- ceived? Ilis' instructions were the best he could possibly have :carried for himself. They were a perfect curte blanche. He was not tied down to any thing. Were, be (Mr. Palmer) would ask, the subjects of Education, of Private Notes, ofannexation to Nova Scotin, any part of his instructions? NO! he would not their let him pass off with iliis pretence; no! no creeping up the lubber-hole in this way; no gliding down to leeward: he (Mr. Palmer) would bring him up totlie wind-turn him to the gale of truth, though - it should even be mingled with a little hail. If the Counsel's opinion was not a part of his instructions, why had the late delegate stated in ,his letter of the 20th September, addressed to the Committee of Correspondence, “ that he should employ Counsel, ifliis answer proved unsatisfactory; that he thought the

. whole documents wopld be submitted to, the law offier of the

lat

‘ \Villiam Cooper, Esquire, l5, Saville Place, Mile End.

AND

way, if there is a way. I cannot promise much for advice; you will see in my instructions that I was allowed £300, currency, in a warrant, to cash which, was only £190, sterling, for my expenses. But if you could obtain an opuiiou from one of the most able Counsel upon that question, I would Williii ly give £10, which I, hope would leave you half for your trouble. I s all endeavour to call upon you on Saturday, and am,

* Sir, your most obedient humble servant,

. Wm. COOPER. Scott Tremain, Esq. 5, Foley Place. ‘

5, Foley Place, October lst, 1839. Dear Sir; I am pleased that you have been so fortunate as to procure a passage. I saw Mr. Taylor yesterday, who came over in the Fleta. He is satisfied with the vessel and master; he paid £16—if you have not con- cluded your bargain, I mention this as a hint. I have. examined your papers, and feel much interested for the tenants. \Ve must not conclude that. Government will not grant equitable terms. I have a. favourable impression ot‘Lord John Russell—he has a. master-mind, and I hope he may pen the answer. If a forfeiture is not insisted upon by Government upon terms, and we are driven to a court Of law, We shall require much ingenuity and perseverance, and a firm and impartial judge. I fear much injuryin this case has arisen from the slumbers of the Attorney General of the Island, who ought to have sought aforfeiture on behalf of the Crown years since._ I agree with you, and by no means admit that the duty was '10 be performed as to an individual. The Crown for this purpose is a Trustee of the people; the leaning Ofihe Crown Officers and Government ought to be with us; it would be so were I Attorney General. Intrigue and interest has operated upon the government here. You are desirous of a. legal opinion; I am much at. a loss, and am like a mariner without his compass—the use of a good library is indispensable. Mr. VVhiteaker, my professional friend, is in Kent. I should like to examine the Commissions Oftlic Court of Escheat in N. S., the Records, the Provincial Statutes, the Orders in Council atP. E. 1., which were laws. I am obliged for your Offer of pay—I will not take it from you unless to do your cause a service, but should wish to see ; you_need not be afraid of occupying my time, it cannot be better e ~ed; I doubt if any correct and decisive course can be pointed out hout first seeing what the Government intend‘to do or to decide upO 2’ must beg you will take charge of a large parcel for me, to be deliv‘ at Halifax; if I am compelled to go to N. Y., I shall wish to get rid

Your obedient servant, SCOTT TREMAIN.

Hon'. Mr. POPE remarked, this was like all that was done by the honourable gentlemgn. He had told them he would satisfy them that he had discharged every duty of his mission, as far as circum- stances would permit; and he had just read them two letters which he wished them to receive as partly corroborant ofliis assertion. But how did those letters hear him out in his affirmation? From the copy of his own letter, which he had read, it did not appear that he had been seeking, but giving an opinion. No (Mr. l’opc) had heard the Speaker say, in. this House, that £160 would be sufficient to defray all the necessary expenses Of a delegate to England; but he had had at his disposal nearly twice that sum, and yet could afford to offer no more than the paltry sum 0f£5 to a counsel for an opinion—£10 between two—£5 for the opinion, and £5 to an agent for procuring the Opinion. Had the delegate lived in so expensive a style, that, out of the ample means placed at his dis- posal, so small a sum, for.so important an opinion as was required, was all be really could afford? ’Mr. Scott Tremain was certainly not known as a man of high standing or celebrity at the Bar, even of Nova Scotia; but from his letter he appeared to be andronest man, that raw art's, an honest lawyer—he would not take a fee where he had done no business. Had he (the delegate) gone home from New York in the saloon of the Great Westernsrand, on his arrival in Londdn, had theil‘t’aken up his rEsid‘ence at ope of the fashion-

’ AI A e A 1‘ -‘ "'

CHARLOTTETOWN, SATURDAY, MARCH 7, 1840.

‘ an aristocrat: “ Vile scum,

.

\—

tomato.

EDWARD ISLAND‘ADVERTISER.

[No. 136.

J3

was a gentleman with whom he had been acquainted nearly all the time he was in London, and from whom he had received many civilities; he was a professional man, and one whom he thought well qualified to lend him that assistance ofwhicli, before directly applying to aiiy eminent English Counsel for a law opinion on this case generally, he stood in need. He (Mr. Speaker) had thought that such a‘ gentleman as Mr. Tremain would know much better than himselt how and what questionsit would be most suitable for him (Mr. S eak‘er) to put to a Counsel, .and, influenced b this opiriion,lie iad,therefore, applied to Mr. Tremain, (explainingtbe matter to him as well as he could,) andtendered him a fee of £10 for his assistance. ,

~ Mr. RAE observed, the opponents of popular rights asserted that the delegate had fallen short of his instructions. They next asserted that because liehad fallen short, therefore the real representatives Of the people, the liberal portion of the Assembly, were wrong in sending him, and should, thereafter, do nothing for their own relief:

as if a lawyer’s mismanagement of a case would be sufficient to ,

prove the cause was bad. They attempted to kill two birds with i one stone, and, by one vote, to get the House to declare that the delegate had not used the means in his power to Obtain justice, and, by the same vote, to declare, that, as he had not used the proper means to obtain justice, therefore there was no injustice. Next, said Mr. Rae, they had a beautiful tirade from the learned member for Charlottetown, about the labouring class of society being always in a state commanding commiseration. There were poor in England, in Nova Scotin,in Newfoundland, and,therc- fore, says the learned member for Charlottetown, the farmers in Prince Edward Island are. entitled to no redress. Nay, more than that, he maintains that they ought not to look for ll-"tllat they never will Obtain it. Why? Why because my Lord John Russell has said he will not escheat the lands. But does Lord John say that no redress will ever be given? No: on the contrary, he seems in dim vision, to see that they must have redress; and lest, like the unjust judge, by their continual coming, he should be wearied, he proposes, or at least considers, three or four difi'erent modes of redress. But, supposing he had said, in the insulting language of e shall have no redress! Beasts of burden ye are, and shall remain !” Supposing that this man had. given utterance to so arrogant and insulting a sentiment, would it be our duty to submit and yield a dumb compliance? Is my Lord John Russell immortal? Are the dicta of a Colonial Minister like the laws oftlie Modes and Persians? Would such a decree, asked Mr. Rae, backed by the opinion of the Lord Chancellor and the whole Privy Council—would it guide the plough? No. Then, continued be (Mr. Rae), if it was found necessary that a rational being should guide the plough, then was their complaint of ancient birth and Ofenduring existence; for, at all times, rational beings, undebased by actual slavery, had complained when required to raise the wheat, and eat only the bran. The learned member for Charlottetown‘and‘his helper had given them a long tirade against dcmagogucs, and those who.stirred up the people. According to such honourable gentlemen, they who had advocated the rights of the people were the enemies of the people-the tenantry were well and happy till those people made them believe they were unhappy‘! Vain and insulting language. The people were stirred up by't e extortionate demands of proprietary claimants, the pettifogging, insulting management of land agents, and the friendly vrstts of constables, to take the beef and leave the bones. Escheat had not been obtained, said these honourable gentlemen, therefore Cooper

, and his friends had led the people astray. The fact was, he said, . ML-Cocper arid. his friends might have been warm,bigoted,vio-

lent, but they had done much mor o I J l

"’77 PI) . I . letter Ofilie 2d Octo er?’litrer~it%‘ili— furtl'efi M" Chd'rm“"* "'- ["5

ie es 's be had a lied to Counsel for advice on behalf of the tenan- iiryguihich adviitgiie hoped to bring with him. Why,then, let age ask, has he not done so? . Had he done so, he knew it must 'e published; and, if'published, full well did he know the client it would have in operating a change upon the minds of the tenaniry -—a change which he by no means desired. Look at his letter bftlie 20th September: see the anxrety lie therein betray: on this account when he says his hopes depend upon the peoplp’: If‘ they were 'to change their opinions, I could do nothing. Oli .er. Chairman, what a sad piece of news it would have been for um, on his arrival in this Island, had he been informed by some of the wortliies who went to gieet him on the shores of the L\Vhite bands, that the people had changed their opinions, and agitation no longer existed : then, indeed, might be have said— ' ' 1“ Farewell ! a long farewell to all my greatness! " .

Yes, Mr. Chairman, well might be dread the edects which a 5|]le and sound law opinion would have produced on the mindsl pfht e people; broadly, fearfully, would it have contrasted ivit Irtl pse statements of his own which he had been so constantly pub is iing

as law; those garbled extracts from Chitty on Prerogative, and from

lackstone's Commentaries with which he had been so long mis- gading the people. He flushed, then, that such miserlable excuses would not prevent the Corgmittee s candidly pussmg t ieir opinion

' l' ate's con not. _ ,

othif grifacifzighereiose and said, he held in his hand a copy Ofn letter which he wrote to Mr. Scott Tremain, a gentleman of the law, then in London with himself, and that gentleman s antsuipr thereto. He said, with permission, he would read éllem )IOf]. Those letters would clearly shew that he did apply-to ounce or degal opinion, although it did not form part of his inst‘ructions. And this Committee would hear in mind, that he had lnot t Le remt; test idea of the correspondence which was taking place etyyteem Downing Street and the Colonial Government. d hiis ougd he weigh a little with honourable members. .It hal-l eenv sag ised ou-ht to have remained in England this WII‘IEEL. e was a v N h lI’Mr. Home and the gentlemen from Nova bcoiia to.retulrn to “It:

olony; and Mr. Hume assured him that he could bring ma ee before the Imperial Parliament as well in his absence .is i Vhite :vgrl- to wait for the rcassembling of Parliament. He did not Wlid o It: hle the Committee with any further explanation, but won t ltfiel‘fh); add, that the ate 8 which he had taken appeared to hlfltll' 0 pm“ Wisest; “and oftIiat he had been more .convmced. Ellltéel is {eusteé when he saw the Despatch from Downing Sireet, in” ie‘ ir that the House would not lose sight of the advantages 6 V ou in

en atch. _ . D e following are the letters above alluded to :— r 15, Savillc Place, Mile End, 30th Sept. 1839. Dear Sir -

you desired to be informed when I engaged a passage to Halifax, I

H the Fleta' she will ' ' f rm on that l have agreed for a passage in _ , gzbewrelii‘do to‘zail until the first of next week. The vgsssltishiméill, 83:1: .cousequemlyy the accommodation for passengers confipe , due 5 w“ e as dobe a well built new vessel, and if they do not loa too ep, .7 1 er vessel. _ fiagehaaqv: rgdgived another communication from the Colonial Office, to say «that Lord John Russell regrets his inability to return to my applicpaiiorzv indie! answer than .that already received. Inrcga'rd tohthe l2: viggdmom you were to give, it will be necessary to bear in mind t at: t8 cwn as an ‘am osed by the original grants were not merely a duty io‘t e I"). d the individual persmi,but a. duty to the Crown in behalf ot the peop t? , an ve Crown refusing to proceed against the grantees according to apt, gs d them the ower to oppress the people, by elxailz‘tmgc exorbitant regisseozoagu, - ' ' ' 'belon ed to the public. ' ft e rown can re . . fi‘iflifgfiz, to regest forfeited lands in ;he Cream, to alfforp Jugs: t: V 't must be inconsrstent oriie rown, iy I'SJU ., giigeplgbdbcgiiidgigsgainst the tenautry, in favour of Such proprietors whose

' .elaims ori inated by the Crown refusing a Court to exact the performance

' ' ' wn rants or the forfeiture of the land. Mr. John- riffohmyifii‘r gbdidit‘bti'lgigiera , said, that it was the parablp offlihe pings; ‘ l d in the New Testament; buiour case is more iuipig‘oiisb a ; Iiigjgra’ble: the lord of the steward for ave him lhis It, e iislaebized {to up lexaeied the utmost farthing from those W were ega >3 extendingindul;

' ereas the crown, withholding a court of Gobi-2311):?“ ubnc properly gone to the grantees, enabled them in impose 8 e that?! obligations u; and ita pears most unjust to release the grantees fromh “we. and me the public,and authorise them to impose a debt upon (ti ? Pfive ifiminis‘ers laws and constitution ofGreat Britain mus} be Very me e" 9 mm amho_ an refuse; court to do justice to the p_u , d, a! e W? the gnaw), fig. a, count" do injustice to the public , 18, l0 P139991; ed, a muff of “'M‘ymfilfim for which rent is found upon “1‘? ema . : con" 0,.

Wheat- N _ , I, think that there, mum. be a way to agraforc: tithe fig!“ oi, mafia main questionof'ndidce would be; ‘0 W

' /

nl" L] t I v at In V p r L

iliat hi; means, if not too small, find yet barely'heen sufficient for his ersonal expenses. But when they should hear that this had not can the case, but that, on the contrary, the delegate had pro- vidently and wisely taken a steerage passage in a timber ship from Halifax, and, on arriving in Lpndon, taken tip his qu‘arters at .Mile End, in the uiifasliionable vuunagepof Wappmguld btuirs; wnere, iflie lived according to the frugality and economy which he ng. Pope), from the significance of the name—Wrapping Old DIZHI'S— would be inclined to think was generally observed there, he could be in no great danger of out:running his means; they, the House, would surely imagine any thing rather than that their delegate had not had it in his power to rocure a competent law opinion, from any lack or insufficiency 0 means to make, eve'nvto a lawyer of liiuh standing and legal reputation, a tender ofa suitable and hand- soiiie fee. In order that no excuse of this kind might have to be made, £50 additional had been granted to the delegate, almost for the express purpose of enabling him to obtain a‘ law opinion. (Mr. Pope) had himself moved that the delegate should mke Wu] him all grievances, whether of old or recent origin, that not even It: nest-egg might be left wliereon to lay new. Ones; and that for: soc purpose he might have access to everypublic office, and have copies \of all papers, documents or records which he might think necessary

to the furtherance of his views. The eXcuse of the delegate was, _

‘ o the Laws of the Island to lay before a CounseL ii]: "HfdeILW that c0pies of’ the Island laws were kept at‘uie Colonial Ofiice, and that there he might have had them, han he applied for them? Did he not know that there yere .many persons residing in London, who are proprietors oflands in ibis Island, and who havinnr copies of the aws of the Island, would have beel‘n glad,to accriinmodate him with them? Many of these indivrdim 5, had they known he wanted a copy ofthe Island laws, an}? parncu. larlv for what purpose he wanted them, would not only av: Deedn ready to send them to him, but they would have had them loun , lettered, and gilt for the Occasion. He not acopy Ofthe ayvsd. What a frivolous, paltry excuse was IlllS...‘ He‘ll/Ir. Pope) Wis ie_ to divest himself, for the time, of all feeli gs fll‘lfllflg opt oi a consi- deration of the escheat question. He, at that time, Wished to clout; fine himselfsimply to the enquiry whether or no the delegatel in! faithfully, according to his ability, discharged the dutiesw iipi devolved upon him in that capacity. In that cqpiicnyd tlie speaker went home to perform certain duties, and, to thiat en , is was provided with certain 'means. The House andht e countkry have a right to ask, they have a right to know, whet. er pg nq‘t thie delegate did his duty,and how the money gracing in rail] or hits mission, had been expended. The truth, iffully roug it to ig , (the delegate's conduct in the matter. wholly Oit OfIhebqlleSltlt‘ént?) would prove to the people that the hopes they that: glen le. s entertain are hopes which will pe’ver be rgfilrsedggcfit reggme